Curse

darkMishkin · Nov 29, 2005, 03:15 AM // 03:15

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dmitri3

And... when you are suicider. sure you can bring all sort of skills. Mishkin's just saying the necessary skills you need to bring :P.

Thanks alot Dmitri3, that's exactly what I'm trying to do, give Sacrificers the fewest required skills, so that they have all the choice in the world after that. How about casting Ward Against Elements inbetween deaths? Anything you want. I'm just trying to distill it down to the most useful, basic build, so that when you want to die, you dont take every damn sacrifice skill "just incase my BiP doesn't work".

+ Vampiric Sword and High Health

msihkin

darkMishkin · Nov 29, 2005, 03:17 AM // 03:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheGuildWarsPenguin

Thought it can be stripped easily, why not bring BiP, res sig and PROT SPIRIT if your a N/Mo? yes or no?

Great, why not bring this for the moments when you are not trying to die? It might come in handy if things go wrong - as long as you keep the duration quite short, so that you can switch back to death mode ^^

msih

Vincent Ritz · Nov 29, 2005, 07:09 AM // 07:09

Easier suicide: infuse health + illusion of weakness, signet of agony, or a vampiric weapon. This is great for corpse factories, but not for super batteries.

darkMishkin · Nov 29, 2005, 03:41 PM // 15:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Vincent Ritz

Easier suicide: infuse health + illusion of weakness, signet of agony, or a vampiric weapon. This is great for corpse factories, but not for super batteries.

Infuse Health would be a nice complementary skill, but you only heal for a % of what you lose, so once you've died a few times it would be useless.

msih

mortalis doleo · Nov 29, 2005, 05:24 PM // 17:24

nobody likes the fact that i can walk after i get ressed in MF builds

seriously, just get wards as ele or aegis as monk... something that you can throw that is cast quickly and is usefull...
even that isnt neccesary though...

Sum Gai · Nov 30, 2005, 03:03 AM // 03:03

Me/x

12+1+3 Fast Casting
12+3 Illusion
0+3 Domination
0+3 Inspiration
Extra Mesmer Superior
Vampiric Weapon

Illusion of Weakness

darkMishkin · Nov 30, 2005, 03:11 AM // 03:11

When I get time I'll edit my first post so that I have several methods of death, EoE Bomb Death, Necro Sacrifice Death...

So many reasons to die!!!

msih

twicky_kid · Nov 30, 2005, 03:17 AM // 03:17

5 sup runes illusion of weakness

wow that was hard and didn't even need an elite.

Tarot Ribos · Nov 30, 2005, 03:28 AM // 03:28

Quote:

Originally Posted by twicky_kid

5 sup runes illusion of weakness

wow that was hard and didn't even need an elite.

True, but too bad you are of no use to the team.

M's point here is the way to maximize usefulness to the team as well as die quickly. Illusion of Weakness just turns you into a corpse. But BiP keeps everyone else's juices flowing, thus increasing the effectiveness of your team. I hear that's what help wins matches, not swiftly dying.

As a Minion Factory build, you're already down one or two team members, depending on how many suiciders you bring. That's 25% of your team whose purpose it is to die repeatedly. The rest of the team should receive some kind of boon as a result to have a fighting chance on top of the minions. BiP gets them that, IoW does not.

The time difference between deaths is very small... what, a second? Two seconds? Using BiP over the 5 sup/IoW build, that is. Rather small time addition, considering Res skills still need energy to be used. Dead, you are of little use to the team. BiP those Rezmers, though, and they can keep doing their job while you do yours. Sounds like *gasp!* TEAMWORK. Who'd have thought it?

monk muffle · Nov 30, 2005, 03:42 AM // 03:42

dude im not a selfish person all i do is sac myself incase you didnt know a mm should hav invest over 10 points in soul reaping and theres 2 mm so if i die they get enrgy so take that!

Tarot Ribos · Nov 30, 2005, 02:01 PM // 14:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by monk muffle

dude im not a selfish person all i do is sac myself incase you didnt know a mm should hav invest over 10 points in soul reaping and theres 2 mm so if i die they get enrgy so take that!

Take what? A false piece of advice based on assumptions that I made arguments that I didn't?

I wasn't talking about the minion masters, I was talking about the rezmers. Pay attention. Last time I checked, Rezmers are generally Me/Mos... hence the fast casting and the resurrection spells. Last time I checked, neither Mesmers nor monks had access to Soul Reaping.

I'm not at all worried about Minion Masters. Soul Reaping does indeed take care of them. I'm not denying that by any means. But what about the other half of the team? And you never actually made any arguments about using IoW vs. BiP. The logic is simple: BiP helps your allies. IoW doesn't. Given spell casting times and recharges, the time difference involved is very small. I'm siding with BiP.

Oblivial · Nov 30, 2005, 02:27 PM // 14:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by monk muffle

dude im not a selfish person all i do is sac myself incase you didnt know a mm should hav invest over 10 points in soul reaping and theres 2 mm so if i die they get enrgy so take that!

As Terot Ribos had said, you need to be an asset to your team. When you have -60 Death Penalty and those Superior Runes, you will end up dieing automatically, which will give mana to the necros but not the rezmers, whereas using Mishkin's build, you can give mana to your Rezmer, and to your necros, all at one time.

-Oblivial

Falrow · Dec 04, 2005, 03:48 AM // 03:48

High health + BiP is much more usefull, in case things go south, different things happen, more efficent skill use, etc... There's alot of reasons to do it this way.

IoW doesn't work we'll because of the 30 recast, which still counts down after you die, btw.

Also, could someone do a test? I'm not entirely convinced that SR goes off on an auto-die. I really don't think it does.

darkMishkin · Dec 04, 2005, 07:03 AM // 07:03

Thanks for your support everyone.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Falrow

Also, could someone do a test? I'm not entirely convinced that SR goes off on an auto-die. I really don't think it does.

Yes you do gain Soul-Reaping energy from auto-deaths - at least from rebirth. I was having fun in UW rebirthing my 0hp monk friend, and just moving him around the map for no reason.

1. Rebirth takes away all my remaining energy
2. Friend dies again I gain 11 energy ready to rebirth again ^^

sno · Dec 04, 2005, 07:33 AM // 07:33

So what other skills do saccers usually bring? you have 6 skills completely unnecessary, so what would be the best set to bring for once you're not dying anymore? :

Zalotiye Slava · Dec 05, 2005, 06:41 PM // 18:41

I believe we found the aftercast for all spells to be 1 second of no-casting, feel free to time it yourself, though. Certainly does not always feel that long to me.

The vampiric weapon is certainly the favorite, with a fun standby to kill yourself being Dark Aura, Chilblains, or Signet of Agony. They take precious time to cast, however, so I will go with Prince Myshkin on this one- vampiric weapons just rule. However, for the dedicated masochist, there are many other options as backups.

High health, low health, it does not matter- when it takes a percentage, it will kill you just as quick.

As for other slots, you can still keep BiPing in the battle. Bring blood renewal for some regen, and you will be unable to kill yourself through saccing alone, allowing you to BiP your whole team if need be.

As for other skills, it depends on the team. Feel free to be an N/R with Frozen Soil, and N/E with Windborne Speed, and N/Mo with Martyr/Aegis/Heal Party, or a number of other useful skills. Never waste a skill slot! Just because you are at 60 DP doesn't mean you can't be useful.